• I live in N.D. We have a state rep who wants to make anyone in our state caught using or selling tobacco products punishable by fines and or jail sentences. The bill didn't pass thank God! I'm wondering whether the rest of you think that maybe, just maybe this politician is overstepping the rights of the citizens of the state. What gives him the right to become a diety and make descisions for all of us? Is it fair for myself, who happens to be older than he, to make it illegal for idiots in office to wear outdated non-matching ties(he was)?

    Christs sake folks, if we elect an Athiest in this state will they start burnig Bibles and alienating or incarcerating people for organized worship? Somethings wrong with these power-mongers. <_<
  • Sounds like yet another attempt at prohibition to me! Haven't these idiots learned yet that prohibition just doesn't work!?!? How many other things out there are detrimental to our collective well-being, yet we don't see those things being banned!?!? (oh, someone wants examples!?......)....... well, let's start with AUTOMOBILES, for example!!! It's all fine and good to stand on your soapbox and preach about all the ill effects of smoking, how it not only hurts the one who does it, but those around you too....... that is if you're not a smoker, but when we start to tell you about how many lives you're risking every time you get behind the wheel of that gas-guzzler, the one which you drive all alone every day 'cause you're too High and Mighty to car pool, oh then you'll suddenly start sputtering about "rights" and junk like that.

    Well, I have a few words for that Bozo, and none of them are "Happy Birthday"!! Sit down and shut up 'till you're called on to speak!!!!! :angry:

    No, I haven't called on you yet, sit back down!! ;)

    Oh, by the way jdm, I'm afraid we've already got plenty of atheists in office already..... surely you don't think any Christian would elect to make a big stink about needing to remove "One nation under God" from the Pledge of Allegiance!?!? And, who do you think has been working so hard to remove prayer from school settings!!? Sheeeeesh!
  • This is a touchey (sp?) subject for me as an ex-smoker. Yes smoking is bad for you and the people around you cannot deny that. I lost a grandmother to lung cancer from second hand smoke. But for politicians to come out and in public and make those remarks is (I find) being prejudice to smokers. And the remarks about the cars and trucks out on the road I competely agree. But you forgot about the major cause of these deseases what about these industrial factories that pump out polutants the equivalent of 10,000 smokers in 1hr.? what about them? are they going to get charged or fined? I don't think so.

    This is just an easy way out for some politican trying to look good in the public by hitting the easy target the smokers.

    Ohh and by the way you actually think that there "trying" to get rid of the smoke factories. Yeah right get rid of one of the most profitable business in the world. Sure...I mean was born in the morning not this morning.
  • D@mn, and i was coming into this thread looking for an entirely different subject matter and i was ready to complain about the language but here i am and no i am not complaining......well, not yet.....or did i already? Anyway, yes smoking isn't good but taking away someone's freedom just doesn't do it for me. I would say that a law such as this doesn't even belong near the court system and i think that it would be a waste of many people's time to even onsider trying to get it pushed through because i don't think it'll ever work out. Again i would like to say i do agree that smoking is bad for ones health and i don't smoke but i feel everyone has the right to smoke if they want to. Well, i hope that you all enjoy posting and have fun gaming.
  • I can't believe this. I figured that politicians would be smart enough to try and slowly ease tobacco out of the marketplace. Oh well, I've been wrong before.

    One thing that I would like to see is that pregnant women be given a special incentive to quit smoking.

    Also smoking around children (especially indoors!) should be made illegal. Children really don't have the power that adults do like going outside when faced with cigarette smoke.
  • Folks, I agree that smoking is harmful. I wish I would've never started. The point I was striving at is the fact that some self-rightious twit is trying to make up my mind for me. When do they want to tell me if I can or can't use an anti-perspirant/ deoderant and can only use one or the other. Why when my dues have been paid inre to being concidered an adult can't I make my own decisions? By the way, the issue was killed by a vote of 88-4. But what was this guy thinking? :huh:

    We all do things which are not probably good for us, but who's to tell me I go to jail if I sit to close to the T.V.? My mom told me it's not good for me, but I've never been threatened with jail time for it. To each their own as long as you don't harm others.

    P.S. there's never been ond documented death from 2nd hand smoke.
  • Oh, JDM1108, how mistaken you are. My cousin died just last year from lung cancer caused by cigarette (tobacco) smoke, and she never smoked a day in her life, yet she was around it from the time she was a child. She's dead, and it's been documented. You work for a tobacco company or something?
  • Originally posted by jdm1108@Jan 22 2003, 08:32 AM
    The point I was striving at is the fact that some self-rightious twit is trying to make up my mind for me.

    Yea that sucks. That's why I never watch commersial TV or the news <_< <br />Man. you gotta realize you're being told what to think every single moment of you life, it starts with your mother and ends with the mortitian.

    I know how you feel though, I've smoked for a while and were then a defender of the habit, claiming that no one can "really" prove it to be as bad as they say.
    What else was I supposed to do, walk around telling people that "Yes, I'm a slave to a drug and I havn't got the will or brains to quit"?

    You really shouldn't get upset by politicians taking action in any question, since you live in a democratic country the bills that pass will be all good ;)
  • I'm sorry people, I had no intention of hitting such a nerve. I just am not a fan of my rights being infringed upon.

    To anyone I've upset, I duely apologize.

    But also my personal right to be upset can't be denied. I only posted for feedback, not to disrupt. I love this site and don't want to ruffle feathers.


    :rolleyes: :D :)
  • Rest assured jdm, ruffled feathers are just a part of life, no harm done. This is a very intelligent thread that you've started and it's good for all of us to share our opinions, especially in the mature and intelligent way we're all doing so, not all stupid and beligerent (sp?). (please feel free to correct my spelling, I'm a POLLACK and proud of it!! :P )
    If some people post in here with oposing opinions, that just means that we are all intelligent, mature thinking people, and there is never any harm in making a person think! (I think)


    Relax and enjoy watching the brain cells fly!! :D
  • Maybe the politition was trying to help
  • It would be very amusing for me, if tobacco were made illegal. Just seeing
    wholesome, law-abiding citizens turn into lowlife, drug abusing criminals,
    overnight, will be very funny indeed.

    If this seems cold & offensive to any smokers here, I don't care, I have no
    sympathy for idiots, IMO stupidity is its own reward. I have been down that
    path, I smoked for just over a decade and out of all my (smoking) friends, I
    was the only one who never claimed to be on my last pack, cutting down or
    quitting soon. In fact the thought of quitting didn't run through my mind
    until I flicked my last butt and I have to say, it's a hell of a lot easier to stop
    smoking than it is to start, or even to stay smoking for that matter.

    I reckon that there is no addiction there, it's all in the head, just a habit, the
    adult equivalent of thumb sucking (& the look is just as cool too).

    In closing I'll say if people want to smoke, let 'em smoke it's their body they
    should have the right to do with it whatever they want, but there should be
    something against thoes heartless, moronic parents who cloud their
    children in smoke. That, IMO, is just another form of child abuse.
  • Originally posted by jdm1108@Jan 22 2003, 02:32 AM
    P.S. there's never been ond documented death from 2nd hand smoke.

    JDM I'm sorry to disagree with you on this one but there have been many studies done on cancer (as you know) and non-smokers with cancer. My grandmother is a perfect example she never smoked a day in her life, yet she passed on from lung cancer (as I have stated before). And seeing someone (anyone for that matter) dying from that desease (sp?) is not a pretty sight.
  • Mr. Gunk,

    The only part of your post that I agree with is the last paragraph...

    In closing I'll say if people want to smoke, let 'em smoke it's their body they
    should have the right to do with it whatever they want, but there should be
    something against thoes heartless, moronic parents who cloud their
    children in smoke. That, IMO, is just another form of child abuse.[/b]


    That is very true. However that is the only part of your post that I agree with.

    I'll leave it at that.
  • sorry rex, but im not with you on this lil doozie.

    I agree with everything Gunk said
  • Originally posted by Lolmuha Tiga@Jan 30 2003, 07:06 PM
    sorry rex, but im not with you on this lil doozie.

    I agree with everything Gunk said

    I don't expect you to be. I expect you to have your own opinion. <_<
  • Originally posted by Kaver+Jan 24 2003, 11:46 AM-->QUOTE(Kaver @ Jan 24 2003, 11:46 AM)
    [quote]<!--QuoteBegin-jdm1108</i>
    @Jan 22 2003, 02:32 AM
    P.S. there's never been ond documented death from 2nd hand smoke.

    [/b][/quote]
    Well, based on my education & experiences working as a Respiratory Therapist, I would have to agree with the above quote, though it's wording is very misleading. The reason why there are no documented deaths attributed to second hand smoke, is because this "cause of death" does not officially exist!

    For example, if you locked someone in a room with a high concentration of second hand cigarette smoke, over a brief period of time they would surely die! However, the cause of death would most likely be documented under a generic medical reference such as smoke inhalation, asphyxia, or perhaps even carbon monoxide poisoning - but this is ultimately determined based on medical analysis performed by physicians.

    I would even go further by saying that there is not one documented death from cigarette smoking PERIOD. Because smoking, or tobacco abuse, is a PREVENTABLE RISK FACTOR leading to disease, NOT an actual cause of death. What this means, is that tobacco products exert an adverse effect on the lungs, which over time, leads to often fatal diseases such as lung cancer, emphysema, bronchitis, pneumonia, etc.

    Contrary to what tobacco lawyers may tell you, the adverse effects of tobacco smoke (in any form) on lung physiology is documented in peer literature and based on decades of substantiated medical research (I'm not going to get into that though).


    However, the decision to smoke cigarettes is up to the ADULT individual, and my personal stance is that if this is something they enjoy and something done in a responsible and respectful taste , then by all means do it!

    Job security, you know;)

    Please don't smoke in front of your kids, I see them in our emergency room all the time with bronchiolitis. Too often, these kids are either exposed to other sick children at day care centers, or to Mom/Dad's cigarette smoke.


    And for those wondering, no, I do not smoke.

    Anything :D

    I never smoked a cigarette in my life, and do not have asthma. However, I do have a slight degree of small airway compromise from my parents second hand smoke, according to actual pulmonary function measurments. (I got bored at work one day)
  • [quote]Originally posted by WreckinBall@Jan 22 2003, 01:48 AM
    [b]My cousin died just last year from lung cancer caused by cigarette (tobacco) smoke, and she never smoked a day in her life, yet she was around it from the time she was a child.
  • Well in keeping with the initial question posted in the thread........ No, I don't agree, with making it illegal to smoke! Not unless the power's that be, are willing to remove every last item knowen to man that can cause harm or death....including Nueclear power/ Weapon's, pesticides, and many other form's of polutant's including gasoline fumes from your car, just to name but a few! And I know I've barely scraped the surface here, but you get the point.

    And although I applaude those who have been bitten by the DRUG nicotine, (and it is that which causes an addiction to ciggie's, and further more has been proven as such!) and have been able to give up. I do however take offense when one's entire intelligence is questioned.
    So, I'm an idiot? Yes, perhaps for this. I know the risks and when I'm good and ready, no doubt I will give up too, , but I don't smoke around my kid's.....the house is actually smoke-free as is the car. My "nasty" habbit is exactly that! MINE!! But I happen to think that apart from that, my intellect is fair if not better than some?
    Be careful when you generalize......I believe it is said that Hitler was a non-smoker etc, and look what a class A idiot he turned out to be!

  • Qoute from lucifer: ...'Automobile accidents'...

    Automobile? What the hell?

    Thats okay rex, I wasnt implying anything, i was just voicing my opinion.
    its just that i usually agree with you on everything.
  • [quote]Originally posted by Bid@Feb 3 2003, 10:18 AM
    [b]I do however take offense when one's entire intelligence is questioned.
  • Besides what Knowze said I think we all can agree on that if we had to put "smoking" in either the "Stupid think to do" or the "Smart thing to do" pile I belive that most people would choose the first pile. ;)
  • Originally posted by Lolmuha Tiga@Feb 3 2003, 09:21 PM
    Qoute from lucifer: ...'Automobile accidents'...

    Automobile? What the hell?

    Thats okay rex, I wasnt implying anything, i was just voicing my opinion.
    its just that i usually agree with you on everything.

    Mmmmmm....Lu was referring to Motor Vehicle Trauma in any case, so be sure to buckle up next time you get behind the wheel!

    In most states this IS the law. :o

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